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So... I'm once again butting heads with IE6. If it would die the death it so richly deserves then it would be much easier for web designers to provide the functionality that people keep asking for. But as it is, IE6 still makes up around 30% of the browser market, and so we're hobbled. 30% of the market uses a browser that's more than six years old, and expects technologies that were invented in the past year and half to work.
So I'm going to ask a general "all my friends list and beyond" type question. As many answers as I can get will be greatly appreciated - so encourage other folks to stick their oars in as well.
The question is as follows:
"What web browser do you use, and why do you use it?"
I'll try to keep the browser evangelism to a minimum (and expect others to do the same). The exception will be to provide people with ways to avoid using the trainwreck that is IE6, or to escape from it's clutches or fix it a bit if you're stuck with it. My general opinion is that people should use whatever browser is best for them, but also that IE6 is rarely best for anybody.
For general purpose browsing:
Opera 9.24, but I'm rather looking forward to Opera 9.5 - development versions are looking rather mighty! Opera is lightweight, efficient, and is the home of so many UI advances it's not true. Other browsers get these advances in the end, but they're usually in Opera first, and they're usually there as standard rather than having to be added as extensions. Basically, with opera, I can install it and go. IE just bugs me too much to use it much, and Firefox doesn't do much that I want out of the box - I have to install a bunch of addons, which often slows things down. Safari just came to late to the party, and most other browsers are too unreliable.
For development
Firefox 2.0.0.9 with a raft of extensions, with Firebug and Operator first and foremost amongst them.
For testing
IE6, IE7, Safari (windows), Swift (Windows webkit browser - alpha, but useful nonetheless), whichever text-only browser I can get my hands on at the time. Soon I'll be testing in some linux browsers as well, and potentially on Safari on a mac.
EDIT:
I forgot... on my home machine, when I'm running in Linux I use either Firefox 2.0.0.* or the public alpha of Opera 9.5. This is because I'm running a 64 bit version of the OS, and these are the versions of those browsers that are available for a 64 bit arcitecture.
So I'm going to ask a general "all my friends list and beyond" type question. As many answers as I can get will be greatly appreciated - so encourage other folks to stick their oars in as well.
The question is as follows:
"What web browser do you use, and why do you use it?"
I'll try to keep the browser evangelism to a minimum (and expect others to do the same). The exception will be to provide people with ways to avoid using the trainwreck that is IE6, or to escape from it's clutches or fix it a bit if you're stuck with it. My general opinion is that people should use whatever browser is best for them, but also that IE6 is rarely best for anybody.
For general purpose browsing:
Opera 9.24, but I'm rather looking forward to Opera 9.5 - development versions are looking rather mighty! Opera is lightweight, efficient, and is the home of so many UI advances it's not true. Other browsers get these advances in the end, but they're usually in Opera first, and they're usually there as standard rather than having to be added as extensions. Basically, with opera, I can install it and go. IE just bugs me too much to use it much, and Firefox doesn't do much that I want out of the box - I have to install a bunch of addons, which often slows things down. Safari just came to late to the party, and most other browsers are too unreliable.
For development
Firefox 2.0.0.9 with a raft of extensions, with Firebug and Operator first and foremost amongst them.
For testing
IE6, IE7, Safari (windows), Swift (Windows webkit browser - alpha, but useful nonetheless), whichever text-only browser I can get my hands on at the time. Soon I'll be testing in some linux browsers as well, and potentially on Safari on a mac.
EDIT:
I forgot... on my home machine, when I'm running in Linux I use either Firefox 2.0.0.* or the public alpha of Opera 9.5. This is because I'm running a 64 bit version of the OS, and these are the versions of those browsers that are available for a 64 bit arcitecture.
Re: Functionality that People Keep Asking for ... :-(
2007-11-15 16:11 (UTC)I'm with you on the filesize thing, though - looking at the source, most of it's nasty inline javascript. Eventually they'll work out that not only does it bloat the pages, but it's totally unmaintainable. Some places have worked this out already, and there are "Unobtrusive Javascript" plugins for most of the major frameworks.
When they get over the shiney new-ness of their new javascript stuff, they'll sort it out and separate it from the markup. If they do that, then they'll be a lot closer to having a page that degrades gracefully without forcing people to download a bunch of stuff that they've already turned off and won't be using.
Re: Functionality that People Keep Asking for ... :-(
2007-11-15 16:27 (UTC)And breathe.
Apparently
http://spacecowb0y.livejournal.com/281574.html
He seems to have a fair amount of grateful applause.
When they get over the shiney new-ness of their new javascript stuff, they'll sort it out and separate it from the markup. If they do that, then they'll be a lot closer to having a page that degrades gracefully without forcing people to download a bunch of stuff that they've already turned off and won't be using.
The really big plus of putting the javascruft into separate files is that I can program my proxy-server to cache it. That makes a big difference to my bandwidth.
It will make a big difference to the bandwidth of the big providers, too, since they use the same sort of solution I do, if on a scale six orders of magnitude bigger.
It will also, ultimately, make a difference to the amount of server capacity SixApart have to run, since they won't have to serve all that bandwidth. That has got to be a non-trivial cost, given how many people use LiveJournal.
As you said, there are a lot of bad developers out there.
Re: Functionality that People Keep Asking for ... :-(
2007-11-15 17:35 (UTC)